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	<title>Comments on: Inflation may be marginally less depressing than deflation . . . .</title>
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	<link>http://thusmagazine.com/2009/01/inflation-may-be-marginally-less-depressing-than-deflation/</link>
	<description>because it does not have to be that way</description>
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		<title>By: John Kelly</title>
		<link>http://thusmagazine.com/2009/01/inflation-may-be-marginally-less-depressing-than-deflation/comment-page-1/#comment-120</link>
		<dc:creator>John Kelly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Feb 2009 14:57:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thusmagazine.com/?p=2161#comment-120</guid>
		<description>Michael

I agree with your pithy analysis, but, respectfully, you don&#039;t address the question as to what happens when &#039;growth&#039; stops, as it has now, in ways which Gordon Brown, saviour of the universe, describes as  &#039;without historical precedent.&#039;

I agree that we need to &#039;post guards&#039; to ensure that inflation is kept under control, but wonder if the drooling halfwits whose unbridled public spending sprees have left the country flat broke in the middle of a global slump are the right sentries.

Thanks for your comment, though. You&#039;re a genuine big brain and I suspect you&#039;ve got an answer or two up your sleeve. I personally think we need to abandon the globalisation malarky. This doesn&#039;t imply protectionism, but it does call for taking care of one&#039;s own business and urging others to do the same. I suspect this will be the US agenda, at least until they have licked their wounds. Europe has never really done us any favours: I suspect the Germans and French will be thinking likewise.

John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael</p>
<p>I agree with your pithy analysis, but, respectfully, you don&#8217;t address the question as to what happens when &#8216;growth&#8217; stops, as it has now, in ways which Gordon Brown, saviour of the universe, describes as  &#8216;without historical precedent.&#8217;</p>
<p>I agree that we need to &#8216;post guards&#8217; to ensure that inflation is kept under control, but wonder if the drooling halfwits whose unbridled public spending sprees have left the country flat broke in the middle of a global slump are the right sentries.</p>
<p>Thanks for your comment, though. You&#8217;re a genuine big brain and I suspect you&#8217;ve got an answer or two up your sleeve. I personally think we need to abandon the globalisation malarky. This doesn&#8217;t imply protectionism, but it does call for taking care of one&#8217;s own business and urging others to do the same. I suspect this will be the US agenda, at least until they have licked their wounds. Europe has never really done us any favours: I suspect the Germans and French will be thinking likewise.</p>
<p>John</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Prescott</title>
		<link>http://thusmagazine.com/2009/01/inflation-may-be-marginally-less-depressing-than-deflation/comment-page-1/#comment-119</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Prescott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Feb 2009 14:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thusmagazine.com/?p=2161#comment-119</guid>
		<description>This takes me back to A level economics...

If the choice is deflation, zero inflation or very low inflation, surely the latter’s the one go to for in that modest inflation is an unavoidable sign of a growing economy?

As the economy grows and demand for goods/services grows, temporary bottlenecks and modest supply shortages are unavoidable... demands exceeds supply for the good/service in question... prices rise.

It’s not a question of aiming for inflation – but aiming for growth, knowing that modest inflation comes with growth, and posting guards to ensure that the inflation does remain only modest.

Michael Prescott</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This takes me back to A level economics&#8230;</p>
<p>If the choice is deflation, zero inflation or very low inflation, surely the latter’s the one go to for in that modest inflation is an unavoidable sign of a growing economy?</p>
<p>As the economy grows and demand for goods/services grows, temporary bottlenecks and modest supply shortages are unavoidable&#8230; demands exceeds supply for the good/service in question&#8230; prices rise.</p>
<p>It’s not a question of aiming for inflation – but aiming for growth, knowing that modest inflation comes with growth, and posting guards to ensure that the inflation does remain only modest.</p>
<p>Michael Prescott</p>
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		<title>By: Peter West</title>
		<link>http://thusmagazine.com/2009/01/inflation-may-be-marginally-less-depressing-than-deflation/comment-page-1/#comment-118</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter West</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Feb 2009 08:48:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thusmagazine.com/?p=2161#comment-118</guid>
		<description>Chris

My understanding is that with a few brief exceptions, like the early nineties, house prices have outstripped wage inflation, making it harder for first time buyers to get on the property ladder. My point was that it was this increase in perceived wealth for property owners that created the spending boom, more than small decreases in mortgage payments, as people spent virtual gains they thought they had made from property ownership.

As for your comments about my “self-indulgent” “folly” of “deflation as a cure for consumerist ills”, this gets to the heart of a really important question that Thus needs to keep an open mind on if it is going to make an interesting contribution.  What makes politics uninspiring to young (and old) nowadays is the consensus which I could describe as Blair-Cameron, but which almost every main stream politician has bought into that says economic growth is good; spending is good; without any regard to the ever-increasing consumption of the world’s resources. For example -  the third runway at Heathrow must happen because it will create jobs and it will create vast acres of new shops for BAA.  Any environmental, ecological concerns are trumped by the economic growth card.

I was not saying deflation was a cure for consumerist ills, I was saying that a bit less consumption would be good for the planet.  How can we preach reducing emissions to the rest of the world if we are always pressing on the consumption accelerator as hard as we can?

Peter West</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris</p>
<p>My understanding is that with a few brief exceptions, like the early nineties, house prices have outstripped wage inflation, making it harder for first time buyers to get on the property ladder. My point was that it was this increase in perceived wealth for property owners that created the spending boom, more than small decreases in mortgage payments, as people spent virtual gains they thought they had made from property ownership.</p>
<p>As for your comments about my “self-indulgent” “folly” of “deflation as a cure for consumerist ills”, this gets to the heart of a really important question that Thus needs to keep an open mind on if it is going to make an interesting contribution.  What makes politics uninspiring to young (and old) nowadays is the consensus which I could describe as Blair-Cameron, but which almost every main stream politician has bought into that says economic growth is good; spending is good; without any regard to the ever-increasing consumption of the world’s resources. For example &#8211;  the third runway at Heathrow must happen because it will create jobs and it will create vast acres of new shops for BAA.  Any environmental, ecological concerns are trumped by the economic growth card.</p>
<p>I was not saying deflation was a cure for consumerist ills, I was saying that a bit less consumption would be good for the planet.  How can we preach reducing emissions to the rest of the world if we are always pressing on the consumption accelerator as hard as we can?</p>
<p>Peter West</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://thusmagazine.com/2009/01/inflation-may-be-marginally-less-depressing-than-deflation/comment-page-1/#comment-117</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 10:57:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thusmagazine.com/?p=2161#comment-117</guid>
		<description>In fact the inflationary 1970s didn&#039;t make it impossible for people to  get on the housing ladder - that happened in 1987-89 and again in 2005-07. Again, the  reason is inflation, or the lack of it. It&#039;s the reduction in debt repayments as a proportion of spendable income that&#039;s the key factor: inflation makes this ratio fall, hence consumers feel better off.
Deflation as a cure for consumerist ills is simply self-indulgence whose folly is evident if you look at the record of the 1930s. Do you really want to create mass unemployment, hunger and poverty to stop us buying flat screen TVs we don&#039;t really need? Excessive consumption was indeed a feature of the past decade, but it would have already been subject to some natural correction if central bankers hadn&#039;t kept credit conditions too easy and if politicians had run large budget surpluses (= higher taxes), which is the correct Keynesian response to a long-running boom. Instead we&#039;re having a more dramatic correction, which will also run its course.
In response to John Kelly&#039;s point about prices rising faster than incomes: of course that did happen in the 1970s for brief periods, but RPI inflation soon became imbedded in labour contracts (as indeed it is now). And yes, there are losers from inflation: but the point is that they are old and rich (or are institutions that  hold money for the old and rich)- and either we take the money from them, via inflation, or today&#039;s workers will have to accept a lower standard of living-  the French, as ever, are the first to show us what they think of that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In fact the inflationary 1970s didn&#8217;t make it impossible for people to  get on the housing ladder &#8211; that happened in 1987-89 and again in 2005-07. Again, the  reason is inflation, or the lack of it. It&#8217;s the reduction in debt repayments as a proportion of spendable income that&#8217;s the key factor: inflation makes this ratio fall, hence consumers feel better off.<br />
Deflation as a cure for consumerist ills is simply self-indulgence whose folly is evident if you look at the record of the 1930s. Do you really want to create mass unemployment, hunger and poverty to stop us buying flat screen TVs we don&#8217;t really need? Excessive consumption was indeed a feature of the past decade, but it would have already been subject to some natural correction if central bankers hadn&#8217;t kept credit conditions too easy and if politicians had run large budget surpluses (= higher taxes), which is the correct Keynesian response to a long-running boom. Instead we&#8217;re having a more dramatic correction, which will also run its course.<br />
In response to John Kelly&#8217;s point about prices rising faster than incomes: of course that did happen in the 1970s for brief periods, but RPI inflation soon became imbedded in labour contracts (as indeed it is now). And yes, there are losers from inflation: but the point is that they are old and rich (or are institutions that  hold money for the old and rich)- and either we take the money from them, via inflation, or today&#8217;s workers will have to accept a lower standard of living-  the French, as ever, are the first to show us what they think of that.</p>
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